Shell Brodnax interview - real estate staging association
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If there's one marketplace shift that's clear and pervasive, it's the shift to online information gathering prior to making a purchase. Well, my guest today is the founder and CEO of an association that's helping people maximize the price of their most valuable asset by making your home look great to buyers, even before they walk through the door. I'm talking today to entrepreneur and author Shell Brodnax with the Real Estate Staging Association about the future of home buying and selling
David Avrin: You know I've had the great fortune of of talking to business leaders and so many different industries. Some of them are relevant to us in business. Some of us are more relevant in our personal life. But everything we talk about affects how we buy and sell, whether we are on the buying and selling side, whether we are those two are selling goes through business, or those as consumers, and of course we are all consumers. But of course, the most significant purchase that any of us will do, and many of us will only do it a few times in our life
David Avrin: is the purchase
David Avrin: of our home or the sale of our home, and my wife and I just went through this about a year and a half ago. We're new empty nesters, and so we we did the big house in the Burb, and we and we got a great brownstone townhouse, and we got a We could walk to restaurants. Life is great, but it was a different time a few years ago. Of course these podcasts are a bit evergreen, and we these, you know, people, will be listening or watching this at various times throughout the years. But we're coming into a time right now, where uh
David Avrin: buying and selling is a little more challenging, as interest rates arise as the Federal Reserve works hard to um tamp down on on inflation. Of course
David Avrin: the challenge for those who are or in the industry is rising. Inflation makes it very, very difficult for people to buy and sell, and so for real estate agents. Not that I diminish the work that they do. But there was a time where it was almost just shooting fish in a barrel. You know you had a listing, and you had two thousand and thirty showings, and maybe ten offers. That's not the case anymore. So the things that we have to do to really maximize the value, how do we make it look great? My guess today is show broaden Acts an old friend. Um! I've actually worked with her before our spoken
David Avrin: some of their events, and and so much about the industry about how important it is to stage your home. So let me do a quick introduction. Uh we'll. We'll talk to her and ask the question. She'll broaden. X. Is the founder and chief executive officer. Excuse me of the real Estate Staging Association. She's an expert leader, visionary author, business strategist, global speaker, and an expert on real estate staging. She's one of the real estate industries most sought after real estate speaker she's been in the industry twenty years. She's co-author of the book
David Avrin: mit Ctl. And uh home staging the power that sells real estate it's a guide to getting the best price for your property, whether your homeowner, agent, or investor. Your accolades include one hundred and fifty
David Avrin: staging and design network leader of the year. Two times Stevie, award winner for women in business uh a finalist and the host of stage or talk for real estate staging podcasts. It's a very long introduction show. I know it's not a great. I I do the same thing when i'm on stage, and they you know all exactly it's and say, Yeah. But who do you want to go? Oh, don't look at me.
David Avrin: Um! So So I I was exposed to this industry probably fifteen years ago. Um, I I bought and sold many houses throughout my life as my kids were growing up as well. But
David Avrin: tell us a little bit about sort of the the early years of this and the justification, and how it's grown.
David Avrin: Because I do want to talk about about how we're able to view houses online the the weeding out process that we're able to do that we weren't necessarily able to do fifteen years ago. So talk to us a little bit about the journey, and we'll talk about how things are changing today.
Shell Brodnax: I don't know about you, but I remember when I was a young, when I was a kid, Parents decided they want to look for a home. What did they do? They grab the Sunday paper, and they looked in the classified for open houses and the neighborhoods. And you that was the first drive by to look at a home
Shell Brodnax: fast forward to the Internet. And now you're looking at homes online. So that's your drive by right now is looking online. So the technology has come on board, obviously over the last twenty thirty years. Um! But now everybody just does that online, and they just
Shell Brodnax: swipe, swipe, swipe next, and and hit the next one, just to look at as many properties as they can, which would normally take them, you know, a whole day to go out and look at that. Many open houses,
David Avrin: sure, but back in the day, and and I think it probably still is the case. You know. You watch some of the the shows on Httv or Diy, and others, and the shows like unsellable houses. And so much of what makes them unsellable is they just look like crap on the inside. People love their own furniture. They love their own style, and it it makes it real challenging for real estate agents to find somebody who likes their style.
Shell Brodnax: Yeah. And so with homes and staging, there's a definite difference between maintenance issues deferred maintenance, which is a big problem with in, you know, just real estate in general when you're selling something. But then you've got your home that your maintenance is kept up. It's pretty well done. Sure, there can be a few fixer things that you need to do. But that's really where the staging comes into play, and so it's. Stager can go in, and if the people are going to live in their home while it's listed,
Shell Brodnax: It's a little bit more difficult because you are dealing with style issues, so the stager can go in and neutralize somebody styles um collections. Things like that can be packed up and put away. So you neutralize and edit down the things that are
Shell Brodnax: so specific to someone's one style, exactly anything personal. You edit that out. And then a stager really has a good canvas to be able to work with. Um. I've seen
Shell Brodnax: some really dramatic results where they may only bring in some artwork light accessories. A lot of the average humans in in North America, Probably don't live in a completely design styled home with the artwork and the whole bit um.
Shell Brodnax: Certainly people average people don't even hang artwork the way it's supposed to be hung. So um, you've got those types of issues so stages can come in and kind of just that up a bit and make it presentable. So people are going to want to see it.
David Avrin: I don't know. I just saw that on Tv the other night. I heard it the other day, too. Talk about, give, give a little huge that makes sense. Talk to it. Talking to me about Clutter. Um, because I, my wife and I were people were obsessed with Hgtv. Um. I do a lot of speaking to the real estate industry, you know, and we joke about the um. The the false impression that people get, you know, by watching house hunters or things like that, because apparently, if you're looking for a house, you only get three options,
Shell Brodnax: the barnyard bungalow, the house on the hill, or the charming Cape Cod. Which will it be right? It's not the world at all, is it?
Shell Brodnax: You know it's it's funny. Um! So i'm losing my train of thought for a second. I'm thinking, selling Alaska. I just love that so. Um! When you get the three choices of it. And, boy, I want to go visit there sometimes. Um! When you are looking at the http aspect of of this Um, it does give.
Shell Brodnax: It gives people an unrealistic expectation a lot of the times. Um, because, you know, back in the day I've been in this industry a long time twenty years one of the real founders of it as a career, you know, to try to get people to do this for a living, and The problem with the Http shows is that it leads
Shell Brodnax: sellers to believe that staging cost fifty bucks and tire card are gonna show up with their shirts off and build them a built in for seventy five bucks, and you're gonna go to the local thrift store and find this fantastic large mirror for this one wall for ten bucks. Um! It's just not reality. Um, It's a Tv show, and it's manufactured, and it actually takes, you know, days or weeks, sometimes to film an episode uh. So those kind of things are. Um,
Shell Brodnax: give a little bit of a uh, just a misrepresentation of really about what it's about
David Avrin: right well, and and the other part is that um misrepresentation of what it costs
David Avrin: to to fix up the house, whether it whether it's remodeling and otherwise as well people say. You know whether it's in wake up Texas, or whatever else, and they've got a total of forty thousand dollar budget. They're re-shingling the roof. They're given a whole new kitchen, new bathroom. They're taking it down to the studs. And i'm like That's the cost of a bathroom.
David Avrin: Right? But once again. It's It's unrealistic. Um!
David Avrin: But but talk to us about about the cost of this, and I want to talk about sort of the the touring in that online aspect. Um, it's not inexpensive. But when you look at the difference between an empty shell where people think they can just envision it, or the second choice, which is somebody else's furniture, which is generally the cluttered or or outdated talk to us about what the research shows in terms of of of of of sales differential
Shell Brodnax: absolutely. So if you're living in the home, there's a saying that we have clutter, eats equity.
Shell Brodnax: Your number One asset is likely the average Americans number one asset is the equity in their home. So Clutter eats that equity. So if you're living in it, that's why they want you to declutter, and that's why they want you to edit those things out is some more neutralize that make the space seem bigger.
Shell Brodnax: But on the flip side so staging works for that, because you're you are making it more appealing to people that are going to want to view it. But on the same note, if it's vacant, and it's completely empty when somebody is looking at it. People think. Oh, they can just envision themselves living here.
Shell Brodnax: Very, very small percentage of people can do that. I think it is. Stats like ten percent um of people can walk in and just visualize where everything's going to go, and how it's going to look so staging absolutely works in the vacant market as well, because stages that with that they really just it up. That's where you come in, and you see from a blank slate a clear canvas that they have actually built an environment that's appealing
Shell Brodnax: right now, like I said earlier, the drive by is on The lot is online right now. So you just don't get those three choices. You get everything and let's face it when you're looking to purchase things. What's the number? One thing that marketers have created in order to help people make better purchasing decisions? My thing is, it's the filter
Shell Brodnax: especially online, because you can filter your results to give you exactly what it is that you're looking for. Home sales is no different. When you go into any of the home sites you filter
Shell Brodnax: by price, you you look at what can I afford? Let's bump that up a little bit more. I can't quite afford it. But I'm Jones, and for it. So I want to take a peek at it anyway, because if I could for it, and I really liked it, what i'm, What hoops am I going to jump through just to be able to get it, maybe, while from a little bit lower.
Shell Brodnax: And so you filter, and you sort in order to look at all this. So your competition is literally everything that's online, and the only chance to have it stand out is staging, or it stands out in the other direction, where you don't want to be remembered for it, because it looked horrible.
David Avrin: Well, and we we're also finding is that people are catching you at the end of the process. I was working with the it. Here's an odd connection working with this dental practice out uh in Princeton, New Jersey, and they said one of the biggest challenges was that people didn't care about quality more? They just wanted to price, and they said, What do you mean? They said. Well, they just call me so. I just want the price.
David Avrin: And I said, Oh, you're assuming they don't want quality, or they don't get they? Or they assume that you have the quality. They assume that you have the capabilities you've caught them at the end of the process. They've already been researching one hundred and fifty.
David Avrin: Um without you. Right? They're saying who's qualified whatever else by the time they call you, it is down to that same thing with phones right? There's there's finite amount of time. We don't want to drive around town. We're willing to do so. But we're We're just going to see the houses that we know we already like, and to be able to see it and do envision it. But here's what's different today, and you know this is not only can you ste it? You can see it in d
Shell Brodnax: right. If they're doing a matter port camera. You can go in that room and rotate and scroll around It's amazing. Yes, absolutely. And stage tones in the vacants, and they're doing that. They look so pristine
Shell Brodnax: they really do It's like. That's what you've got to compare. You know, when you're a home seller and you're you're looking at. Say, can I afford to stage? And I think, Oh, my gosh! He can afford not to stage. This is this is staging to recession proof, y'all cause in a slow market a stage home is going to get the traffic and get the attention and sell and the non-stage tones. Aren't going to sell and in a hot market you're going to get multiple offers and sell for over list price. So it's a win-win, no matter when it is that you're doing it. So if you invest,
Shell Brodnax: i'm just going to use a round number Five grand in the staging, and you made twenty five thousand over List price you
David Avrin: you just needed twenty grand, so you're speaking with, and you have a better idea because you have better traffic. I think it goes back to what you were making that we're we're we're we're scrolling through. We're weeding things out online, right? So as you look at sort of the process of getting to Yes, which is true for so many incremental sales, for so many different business models. What's the first? Yes, like in my business, because I speak for a living. I need to get a meeting planner to my website to watch my preview Video: That's it. That's my my leading indicator. People watch that video.
David Avrin: So I've got a good shot, or at least we're going to have a conversation afterwards, but if they don't I have zero chance, it's the same thing. They don't at least look online like what they have, and schedule a showing, and then, of course, you go in there, and you want it to look just as nice. They can envision their furniture because they see that furniture. But one of the things I always say in business is your greatest source of lost revenue
David Avrin: is the customer you never knew about
David Avrin: right, and I think probably real estate is, is indicative of that more than than most, which is every buyer that doesn't come to see. Your home is a lost prospect a lost person who might be bidding against somebody else and driving up that price. So that online experience to talk to us for a second about how the online experience has changed compared to even five ten years ago. Not just that they can look. But what are they seeing today? Because we used to be able to go, and we could see pictures of
David Avrin: of different houses. What's different today?
Shell Brodnax: The quality the quality out there is just different staging has changed twenty years ago, David, when I got into this industry.
Shell Brodnax: I I kid you not. People were staging with like cart. No, those portable card tables remember those that they the legs extended out,
Shell Brodnax: and then throw a um a table cloth over the top of it, and it's like cool that would never fly, or cart or cardboard Tvs, or things like that. They did have the props of that of the cardboard stuff. It just doesn't fly today, and even back. Then they did um blow up camping beds for the beds, and then the deflate,
Shell Brodnax: and now it's like stages, real stages. No, we we're bringing a bed in y'all. It's a bed, it's a bed, it's solid. Um people jump on beds. I don't know why it is that people do this when they tour homes, but for some reason they feel the need just to kind of jump up and jump on a bed, and if they use the cardboard boxes in the past, and they just sink down. It's dangerous. It's all bad. So you just get you really it, Lot of these staged homes. Now look more like a model home like your typical, you know, when you go see a model home in a track um somewhere.
Shell Brodnax: So you just get a lot better quality in addition to that, with the professional photography. That's
Shell Brodnax: the icing on the cake. So if you're going to stage it, you have to invest in that pro photography, because again you're being used to being filtered one way or another, your house is being filtered online, and it's going to be compared to the other ones, and you got to stand out. Yeah, Why, I like what you said when we're talking about sort of comparing them to model homes. Nobody knows more than home builders themselves about what sells a house right? And you've got their three or four models, and they're and they're decked out decorated well as model homes.
David Avrin: And so this is an opportunity to help individuals look like they have a model home right even for a pre-owned home to look like a model home. How much do you find yourself having to walk that very sensitive line
David Avrin: of people being enamored with their own furniture decorating? I don't need to do this stuff. My stuff is great. I can declare a little bit. My stuff is great. How do you have that conversation in a way that helps people get it,
Shell Brodnax: because people are are pretty sold on their own taste, like everybody, says i'm an excellent driver. No, they're not excellent. That's a great question, because um! If somebody's called in a stage, or already
Shell Brodnax: they already know something needs to be done, because if they were really in love with it, and they thought it was all that in a bag of chips they wouldn't have called in the stager, so the stages got the foot in the door at that point. So the first thing is just to start with a consultation, just talking to the homeowner. What are your goals? What it? What is it? Where are you going? Where are you moving? We ask why you're moving. Figure out the entire picture because all of that actually does matter, and it matters to be able to help them and guide them through the process. Because if they, if especially if you're in a couple of situation and
Shell Brodnax: one person's on board, and one person's, you know, pumping the breaks. You have to be able to figure out the dynamic of why it is that we're moving, and how can I help you reach your goal. So the bottom line comes down to is like
Shell Brodnax: the way you live in your home. This is a great quote back from twenty years ago. The way you live in your home, and the way you market and sell your home are two different things. Um! So it's one of those things that now it's a product. You can't. You love your home? That's great. I love your purple bedroom with the gold everywhere. It's, boss. It's awesome great taste.
Shell Brodnax: But for selling your home we're gonna to that down a little bit, because we want everybody likes that, and then it makes this homeowner have to come in and redo something. So even with my own husband, he said, So I won't. Just leave it for them, and they can just do it, and i'm like
Shell Brodnax: to ching to ching to ching out of our profit. Because if you invest a little bit in some of these things like neutralizing the paint colors, or maybe even a swap out of countertop.
Shell Brodnax: Then it eliminates the buyer from having to do it and take on the additional cost, because most people have the money to get into the house these days, but they don't have money like you did in the fifties to be able to get that fix or upper, and just go in and start just doing things over time and making it your own
Shell Brodnax: um. So you want to give them at least amount of opportunity to reject something so as long as it's updated fresh and new and neutral. Then they can come in, and they can use it up the way that they want to with the rest of the design plan in the home.
David Avrin: Talk to me about the business model a little bit uh how much of that. Um! How much
David Avrin: do you own yourself in terms of the furniture? Do people generally rent what they need? Do They build up inventory over time that they can. They can select from a courts. You see it on Tv, and and Joanna Gains will go into their barn and grab this and this and this, and all the different pieces I would assume. There's a lot of different ways that people go about this business. There are. There are so many business models. There are stages that focus solely on the occupied market. They only want to work with the homeowners that are occupied. Why? Great question. I love to answer.
Shell Brodnax: They have no inventory. They have no overhead. They it's just working on that. So they make bring in some art and some accessories. They don't typically bring in like soft goods, pillows, betting, and things like that, because children in pets, and
Shell Brodnax: you don't want to get your your money maker back that your inventory with stains on it and whatnot. So they work with the occupied market. And then the ones that do the vacant. You can either rent furniture in certain areas. But you're going to be limited in your scope and choice. But the professional stages that are most of them that are really out there, just
Shell Brodnax: cleaning house, so to speak, where they have that employees. They've got
Shell Brodnax: warehouses that are fifteen, twenty, thirty thousand square feet. They've got forklift. They've got moving trucks. They've got entire teams of people that make this happen so a lot of times,
Shell Brodnax: you know. You're looking at professional staging, and I know Http. Makes it look like they just be witch it. And stuff happens. There's a plan that comes into place because they do have to pull their inventory so they can go, and they might have fifty sofa to choose from, and they're just shopping in their own warehouse, and they load it into a truck. And so they're delivering it, and then homeowners often box some time at the fees. But it's like if you're gonna hire Mayflower movers or beacons to come and move you.
Shell Brodnax: How much do you think they're going to charge you for just for that move but a stages bringing the furniture in designing it? And then they're going to de-stage it and take it out as well, and they're making you money while doing it, while a mover just made money
David Avrin: right when you're moving twice everything in and everything out. But on the Tv show. It's the last five minutes of the show. It's like, Now it's ready for staging, and All you do is see people, you know, doing the crowding shop in the middle of the pillow to create a little V shape, and and that's the end of the process. Well, that was fast.
David Avrin: It didn't work that way. What about? Tell me about the people? And then we both have talked to a lot of people like this who who fancy themselves, and they they may be accurate as great designers. I'm really good with my home. All my friends want me to help them with their homes, and they're looking at this as a potential career for them.
David Avrin: What are the What are the the pluses, and what are the minuses.
Shell Brodnax: Here's the thing.
Shell Brodnax: It's a real legitimate business. So there are people that get into this, and, like all entrepreneurial type businesses All let me go. Try this, and they don't realize that you have to work at it in order to make it successful. Um! It just doesn't come to you. Um. So with staging. There's very much right brain, left brain. So you've got a lot of creatives like you're describing, I, you know, rearrange my bedroom when I was a kid. I love the Barbie Dream House. My friends have me come over, and and you know, rearrange their furniture.
Shell Brodnax: My husband doesn't know what it's like when i'm coming home when he's coming home. It living rooms different. You've got those people, and that's great, and they have some skill sets, and that's awesome to be able to have that but staging the home
Shell Brodnax: like you just said a minute ago on the show that's the last five minutes of the project.
Shell Brodnax: That's the last little bit that they do is actually stage the home. The rest of it is the business end of it where you've got to grow the business to get the clients to close the sales. So with right brain, left brain. There's a lot of times. The creatives don't have the analytical side, and they don't have the skill set to be able to do the sales and to grow the business and figure out the marketing and all of that. So that's where you It does you well to partner with somebody has the other side of the brain. So that's the biggest thing, I think, in the staging industry is that um very few people have,
David Avrin: and you they do gravitate one towards the other, no matter what um but it's the stamina and the stamp wanted to to to keep that because it's it's different. It's one of those industries that I say it's like staging is not a business. It's not getting the gig is the business. Staging is the art.
David Avrin: Staging is is the fun part. Staging is the decorating, but the business is getting the gig right business is getting the clients. So how much of that tell us a little bit more about the model for those who are on indoctrinated? How much of it is dependent upon great relationships with realtors. And how many people find uh stages personally themselves? And and where does that encouragement come from? Is that the the agent who says we need to stage this one.
Shell Brodnax: Yeah, absolutely. So finding stages can happen in the myriad of ways. Sometimes agents just know about staging. They seek out a stage, or they want a relationship, but for the most part they kind of view it as like one season, two, Z. I'll call you in when I think that I need it.
Shell Brodnax: What I coach staggers on is a completely different mindset is that they right now that the model is that they allow themselves to be interviewed to see if that customer wants them for the job,
Shell Brodnax: and i'm like, Oh, I don't that doesn't work for me. Let's flip that script around. Why are you not interviewing them to make sure they're the right customer for you? Because then, if you don't, you get a Peter right? Nobody wants to, Pita, and
Shell Brodnax: you have to screen these people, and when you're talking to them, find out, What are your goals? Why are you moving, and when are you moving? Can you meet all of their needs? Number one?
Shell Brodnax: Um! Are they finding value in what it is that you do? Have you been successful at selling the value of what you're doing? So they're gonna They're gonna meet your fee and not have a problem with it. Um! So staggers. What I encourage them to do is to become part of the real estate team, not working for somebody, but having a collaborative relationship. So when you're looking towards real estate agents, I say, infiltrate where they are. If you want to get business from real estate agents, you need to party where they party. So that means that you join their local association of
Shell Brodnax: realtors. You join their Women's Council of Realtors, the Builders associations things like that because they have networking meetings, sometimes weekly, weekly,
Shell Brodnax: and they're all real estate agents. It's like shooting fish in a barrel. I don't understand what the problem is with people that can't go into a room of fifty people and walk out with a few clients. So you've got to go in and you've got to build the relationship, and you've just got to become one of them. Become a top producer in your area. Don't wait for it to happen. Go out and do it. So you go to their meetings, you go in your network, you sit down, you talk to them, you're at your meals with them, you don't sell yourself, and then, for
Shell Brodnax: the love of everything that's totally in this world, do not ask them to take them to lunch or pick their brain, but that's not the approach be. I teach status to be a little bit more elusive, you know. Kind of like the Sasquatch.
Shell Brodnax: Who is that? Where is that person? Who is that person over there be elusive. Ask them about what they're doing in their business if they're going to ask you, but don't go on and on about it so people wouldn't want to look at what they can't have
David Avrin: to give samples of the kind of work they do, and the variety, you see stages sort of specializing in contemporary. You get ones who kind of do everything. Certainly that the chip and Joanna game gains very much the farmhouse kind of a style. Uh, what are you seeing out there? What do you advise for the people that you advise?
Shell Brodnax: Well, stages? I think the portfolio is very important. Number one. It should only be professionally shot photos. If you're if you're not willing to do that for your own business, You' it's hard to sell, staging that It's that important. You You want to put your best foot forward with that and your best work, and he doesn't have to be,
Shell Brodnax: You know, thousands and thousands of pictures put, you know, a good ten, twenty projects in there, and show the variety of what it is that you do. But with stages the good thing is with staging. It's not about their personal style. Um! Some things might gravitate. They might have, like we call like a signature. Look, but that's also because they are probably staging the same type of architecture, but stages Usually their inventory can be very universal where it can go in one type of architecture home, and it might go in another one so it could do something a little bit more modern.
Shell Brodnax: I do a little bit something more bungalow, kind of cottagey look, and they should be able to pull off multiple looks.
Shell Brodnax: Strong business model. Think about it if you are especially in the luxury market
Shell Brodnax: when you're walking into a home, and it's really done. Well what you're like. Oh, this is my jam. I've done done done, and and they will make an offer in stages, you know. A lot of them are in the market. To do this we actually had a session at our resicon. Um. Matthew Phillinson is a very popular stage, or in our industry. And I actually were speaking to the same conference ten years ago. Yes, he was there. He's he's teaching people now, and coaching people, and what he does is he shops his inventory,
Shell Brodnax: knowing that he's going to sell it.
Shell Brodnax: He's in a luxury market. He's in Los Angeles. It's really good for what it is that he's doing. And during the pandemic he was able to keep his business afloat by selling the furniture because he had the furniture, and there was a supply chain issue. Nobody could get furniture.
David Avrin: Yeah, brilliant and good. Got all right. Put on you in the last couple of minutes that we have real quickly put on your Chris, your your I don't know Crystal Ball. I was mixing metaphors. They take out your crystal ball. Put on your magic cat. Um!
David Avrin: Talk to us, I mean
David Avrin: ten years from now, and it's hard to predict so many things are changing. What's it going to look like. Is it going to be virtual reality? We're going to put on on the uh on the headset and walk through the homes and and decide at that point what we want to go see in person.
Shell Brodnax: Will we ever have to go see it in person? What do you think is coming down the pike.
Shell Brodnax: I think technology is going to take us where you can have it virtually staged, and you see the photos online. But then, when you go to the home you can take your camera phone and
David Avrin: move it around the room and hit a button, and the picture will come up about how it's staged on your room with like your own furniture in the space, probably even doing that as well. But I definitely think there's going to be some virtual aspect. Um of walking through the house with an ipad or a phone, or something along those lines, or even with it, with the the video or the higher definition that we're taking of an actually staged home. But just being able to go through and from the perspective, what would be if I sat here. What would I be able to see from this direct?
David Avrin: But yeah, it's all pretty exciting. I listen. I'm: i'm a of a big believer in in the importance of all of this as well. But for me, what's what's fascinating for audience is recognizing sort of the business aspect of of how people buy today, and people look online, and they weed out those who are not qualified uh beforehand. And so the things that we can do to make ourselves look as attractive as we can.
David Avrin: Prior to that, everybody that we lose in that process is a lost opportunity, and, as I said, the greatest source of lost forever. She'll broaden next from the real State staging association of people want to get in touch with you. How did they do that?
Shell Brodnax: Absolutely go to real Estate Staging Association dot Com. And my email is shell at Resa Dash Hq. Dot Org.
David Avrin: Okay, And shell S. H. E. L. L. Actually, you can see in the bottom corner for those who are watching the video version of this shell. Thanks so much for being with us. Nice to see you again. Hang on. We'll talk on the other side, so hang type for a second um, and I grab my prop here. You can pick up a copy of my new book, the Morning Huddle.
David Avrin: Powerful customer experience conversations to wake you up and shake you up and win more business. In fact, all of my books are available on Amazon. Some of them, as you can see, strategically located next to my head here in multiple languages. As well be sure to click to like this podcast subscribe, and you'll get notifications of new episodes. Click the little bell icon uh, and you can learn more about my speaking and my consulting on customer experience at David Averincom.
David Avrin: Thanks again for tuning into the customer Experience of Edge Podcast. Leave a comment really important, and subscribe big thanks to my I guess shell Broadenecks I'm David averin be good.