Sam Reese Interview - CEO of Vistage
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Ken Blanchard famously said that "none of us is as smart as all of us". We're all limited in our knowledge and perspective by what we've experienced: our personal and professional wins and losses. Well, no organization has leveraged that collective wisdom, mastermind set philosophy better than Vistage. Today on the podcast, I'm pleased to be talking with Sam Reese. He's the CEO of Vistage, the world's largest and most successful CEO coaching and peer advisory organization. We're going to talk about how to bolster your experience, your perspective, and your professional network, so you can make better decisions and future proof your business model.
David Avrin: This is a good one today. This is this actually an organization that's that's near and dear to my heart. I'm sure most people have have heard of mastermind models. Maybe perhaps you you're a part of one with other peers within your industry. But
David Avrin: the real beauty of the model is is the is the groups that the groups that are non competing. What do we learn? What can we glean from others who do what we do or are where we are? But they don't do exactly what we do within that model. Napoleon Hill really coined this originally earlier, but but very well known in his book.
David Avrin: Think and grow rich 1,937 talked about creating this mastermind alliance, as he called it at the time
David Avrin: when you put 2 people together there's sort of this third mastermind, and when you put multiple people together, then you've got something that can be magic. Well, today I want to talk. I'm fortunate to talk to the leader of the world's largest organization. We're going to talk about the model itself. What it can do I'll do the quick introduction first, the former one, Sam Reese, is the CEO of this stage, the world's largest CEO Coaching and peer Advisory organization for small and mid-size businesses over his 35 year career as a business leader he's led large and mid-sized organizations, advised Ceos and key
David Avrin: executives or companies, all over the world previously Sam led Miller Hyman.
David Avrin: which is one of the largest dedicated performance improvement companies in the world. As the CEO of Miller Hyman, revenues and profits increased, nearly tenfold product offerings were expanded, 5 acquisitions were completed, and an expert network of consultants was amassed around the globe. And now he's using that expertise in helping build the world's largest network of Ceos with vistage. Sam welcome to the show today.
Sam Reese: Great to be with you, David. Yeah, it's. It's fun when when I I hear my intro it's fun to think how great it sounds, and of the finality of it. And then I I have flashbacks of how hard it was to get some of those things accomplished, and how many ups and downs are really were.
David Avrin: Yeah, it's one of those things where I I heard somebody talking about sort of those of us who are a little bit older in the work, and the whole idea of of been there still there. I've been there done that you're still doing it and and build this organization, and in full transparency, I am actually a former chair with vistage. About 15 years ago I led groups in the Denver area. I've spoken for over 500 of them on 4 different continents. I I bleed vistage blue. I so believe in this model. Of course there's other organizations that do this as well.
David Avrin: But this is was really one of the pioneers. Tell us, Sam, tell us about sort of the early days, the tech days, and how this organization grew to where it is today.
Sam Reese: It's it's amazing when when I look at our business. Now, you know 45,000 members across 35 countries, but it's just over just over 65 years ago it all started in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, Our founder Guy, named Bob Nurse, was sort of a failed consultant was trying to help businesses any way he could. He just
Sam Reese: really kept striking out, and he finally said, You know everybody, i'm talking to all these leaders. They seem to be struggling with the same issues, and I'm not helping them. Maybe I just bring them together. So sort of a legendary meeting brought these, you know 7 8 leaders together in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, and just had them start sharing.
Sam Reese: And one of the things a lot of people don't know, is when when you read his book, his memoir. He talks about the first issue that was ever processed, so he he's got these 8 people around the table. They're starting to listen with each other. See if there's a way they can help each other. Non competing industries like you said, and somebody says.
Sam Reese: no. My number one issue is, I can't find a good sales leader.
Sam Reese: And so they start processing the issue. Another one raises his hand and said, I have a good sales leader.
Sam Reese: But the issue is i'm just gonna be uncomfortable. He's the one you fired.
Sam Reese: and that's what open it all you basically and where that issue went is, it's not the sales leader. That's a problem. It's you. That's a problem as a CEO, and that's really what launched the concept in the businesses just you know, continue to grow since then.
David Avrin: and and the lore, you know, lives on from some of those early ones, but I think it's certainly indicative of what the model is for those who are uninitiated. I think people have heard of mastermind, but there's there's a difference between gathering together with your peers and comparing notes. I was just last week I was in in Dubai, and I had the wonderful opportunity to connect with several of my speaker peers, who just happened to be in the same city, speaking for other events, and we got together. But that's different. It's different than the model where we are bringing together where you
David Avrin: you are bringing together as an organization leaders from non competing organizations to go into room once a month, close the door, take off the mask metaphorically and otherwise, and hash out their biggest issues. Talk about sort of the the importance of the non competing, the the the insights that you can glean from somebody else who is in the same position.
Sam Reese: but doesn't deal with the same industry. What's the benefit? What's the model? How does that work?
Sam Reese: Because for leaders to really learn and to really grow. You're gonna have to expose your your vulnerabilities. I mean all of your warts got to be their front and center. If you're in front of your your competing peers, you're trying to position. Make sure you're not saying something that's, you know. Gonna Be confidential. So this is all about non competing, and the magic of that.
Sam Reese: So that that's the first part. But the magic is. Then we have a chairman or chairwoman who runs that meeting that's an expert facilitator that knows how to drive out
Sam Reese: the difficult issues. And there's a the process. We have some intellectual property that that goes with this and the way that we process issues. But it's got to be safe, you know. You've got to come there with vulnerability, and that's where the magic really happens if you're
Sam Reese: want to join one of these groups at least visage, and you want to come to tell people how smart you are. That's not going to be a great experience. It's gonna be, you know, one day, and you'll be gone because you're gonna have 1415 other Ceos in the room, and I don't think you're that smart. Let me give you a few a little bit of feedback.
Sam Reese: but that's where you really get the feel for
Sam Reese: the fact that the best way to make decisions is when you get other perspectives
David Avrin: rather than just sitting. Ceos. We're tending we we can. It can be a lonely job. You could just think I got to figure it out in my own little room, and, you know, Shut the door that doesn't work. If you're making big decisions, you want to get more perspectives, and that's what we really do is drive more perspectives. Yeah, absolutely. But the other thing what you find with very smart people, and it's not just about being called out. It's that these are people who are all used to leading their organizations, and this is one day a month where they don't have to be in charge.
David Avrin: Right? It's it's not even that they're being put in their place. It's. This is their time to sit in a collaborative environment. Talk about the importance of that facilitated model because you and I have both been in meetings that that can quickly devolve right. First of all, nobody needs another meeting right.
David Avrin: but but it can also devolve. When you've got powerful personalities in the room. You've got a a different mindsets and without sort of let's put it in
David Avrin: in these terms: Without a traffic cop to keep things on track, they can fall off the rails and and take unnecessary time. Talk about the facilitated model and and the benefit of all that.
Sam Reese: Yeah, be my pleasure. I mean the the key to our our business for these amazing chairman and chairwoman that run these groups. They're the ones that facilitate it. All former executives themselves, who are trained in message methodology. As I said, it's it's got to be a safe space.
Sam Reese: So what they're able to do is to bring out the issues and make sure we could have difficult discussions and make sure nobody is trying to position or in you know the loudest voice doesn't win. So you you think about it. I I might say something that you're uncomfortable with
Sam Reese: right if if it's just us, and there's nobody facilitating, and we we kind of go. I'll just i'll be quiet and move on. You know you say i'm not. It's not worth it. You gotta facilitate or leading that it's like. Well, hold on. I think what you just said, Sam, is something that David might be uncomfortable with. Let's address that for a minute.
Sam Reese: So think about how that makes the room Change the other part that's powerful about our model is our coaching model is. We have. This group gets together once a month, but the chairman or chairwoman also gets, together with each individual in their monthly one to one.
Sam Reese: and where they spend their time, is trying to figure out how to position the issues that they're going to take to the group. We have a belief, you know, if you and I, if if you were my executive coach
Sam Reese: we could talk about all sorts of great things. We have a belief that the big issues we got to take to the group, even though it might be your sweet spot to help solve it. David, you still want to take it to the group, because that's what we think will get the best perspectives.
Sam Reese: and that when you create that sort of safe environment. Now I have the permission to open myself up to say I I don't know what i'm doing here, or I made a mistake, or this is something i'm struggling with, and that's what we make it very safe space to do that. And that's how learning happens. Loren Doesn't happen if i'm still going to be the CEO in that room and tell you, guys, how great I am. Learning does not happen that way.
David Avrin: Well, but that's the difference between consulting and coaching isn't it, you know, in a consulting model that that consultant in this case would be the message chair leader would be the person who would prescribe the answers, and the reality is their job is to make the space.
David Avrin: because the benefit and the thing that I've seen in in the groups, and the ones I've spoken to in the groups that I've facilitated is there's a room full of individuals who like literally what it would cost you for one person to come in and consult for a couple of days. You get a You get a board room
David Avrin: full of 12 to 15 Ceos, who give you such vast perspective, because at the end of the day you're the one who has to make a decision what you're going to do with it.
But the the privilege of having those kinds of unbiased opinions insights
David Avrin: to help you filter through to make the decisions you need to make, that to me has has always been the beauty of the organization.
Sam Reese: Would you like to have a day a month where you can sit with, you know, 1213 14 other Ceos non-competing right here in the area that want to work on your problem.
Sam Reese: Right? I mean that that's pretty compelling. You know we in our business. There's a a little bit of our folklore since I've been here. I've been here 8 years, but I was a member for many years before. That's how I knew vistage. I was a member when I ran Miller Hyman. But the way I got there is I got there because I was a typical
Sam Reese: CEO, who thought I knew all the answers. All I want to do is be a CEO. And then I became a CEO of the that the company, Millerheim, and you know, way back 20, almost 5 years ago.
Sam Reese: and I sort of stunk at the job.
Sam Reese: I I mean, that's all I want to do is be a CEO and and I. We got to the point where I literally quick. I I flew out to San Francisco, met with the board and said, it's all I want to do is be a CEO. But i'm gonna go back to run and fortune 500 sales organizations, because I stink, you know. Sorry.
Sam Reese: And the chairman of the Board, said he. You you don't stink, you know you. We like you, and we're we're gonna get you help, You know there's this organization back there back. Then it was called Tech. You learn how to how to go to tech, and you'll learn how to work with all these other Ceos.
Sam Reese: and it was, you know, that that was transformational experience, because once once I started and it took me a while. Few meetings where I didn't want to reveal where I was weak, and the fact that I didn't have experience but that's that's why this company is still near and dear to my heart. Is it changed the trajectory of my whole career? But it was from my own.
Sam Reese: You know, failures that brought me
David Avrin: to this is so you can see why i'm such a passionate advocate for it. Yeah, what I mean, we we'll take it back to the whole value proposition to begin with, which is organizational leaders. They've got employees. Maybe they have shareholders. They may have have partners.
David Avrin: but they don't have peers, and to have that same environment. Because I I I've seen these in these in these meetings. You talk about cash flow when you talk about personnel, and you talk cancer, and you talk divorce. This is that that that room where once a month
David Avrin: you can have these really candid conversations, these are the people you go to war with, and these are the people that you go to Kabul with for me when when I was sharing, and would have my one to one conversations the best. There was one time I I got done with a a one to one, and actually we had done it out at a restaurant, and it spent a couple of hours
and hit the restroom. Afterwards I come out, and there's a love note on my car
David Avrin: from this leader, who just said, Thank you for for the role that you play in my life
David Avrin: and to me was so incredibly gratifying. But for the members itself I mean for each other. You see.
David Avrin: this, this really rare opportunity on the front end there's oftentimes a little trepidation way. It's a day like a whole day when you realize the the benefit of this collaborative environment. Tell me, tell me why.
David Avrin: Why? Why do people join?
David Avrin: And then let's talk about why people stay? Because sometimes it's a different answer. Isn't it.
Sam Reese: You're right. Yeah. Well, I think people the reason people join originally is they're saying, I I realize I've got to spend time working on the business. I gotta get away from the day to day. I gotta have a a space where I can get out of it
Sam Reese: and work on the business, and as all the things we've talked about with people that can give me incredible perspective. So because because Ceos really are in the business of making decisions, that's that's why they come now. It lines with our purpose. We have this purpose for us is, we? We say it's all about helping high integrity. Leaders make great decisions that benefit their companies.
Sam Reese: families, and communities, and it it speaks to what you said. There, David, is why, why we say integrity. Integrity comes from 2 words, it comes from integer, which means whole, and then it's integrate, or it's in the word integrated as well. So that's what we try and do is we try and say, hey, you! You got to live a whole integrated life as a leader. It's not just being the CEO.
Sam Reese: And so when you think about that? That's what happens in these meetings is we gotta be whole people, because maybe some of the struggles i'm having in my business connect to my personal life, or connect to other things.
Sam Reese: Everything is connected, and that's what we we believe is that people have happiness in their life. They don't have dissonance in a leader, if they can be that same person and all in all facets, and that
Sam Reese: that's where it takes it. Why they stay is, is, they stay
Sam Reese: because first of all, they get real results. I mean, I, you know, I remember, is incredible how much they outperform people that don't have a visage organization in their repertoire. I mean, you know, back in the great financial crisis we did a big thing with, done, and Bradstreet measured, and our members were like 2 X
Sam Reese: better performing and top and bottom line. So they perform. They build these great relationships. and and they have this place to go where they can work on the business and not feel like they got to be
Sam Reese: the answered person. I mean, they they want. They want to go to that so they so they can get that feeling as well as
Sam Reese: they want to help each other. And I would say as a member myself, I I learned sometimes more helping someone else, because when i'm trying to help you i'm thinking, boy, I stink at that, too. Here's some insights I have, but I gotta go fix that
David Avrin: come from somebody else's issue.
David Avrin: especially for the don't recognize. You know what I think. I got that issue as well, but wouldn't you say also, Sam, that that
David Avrin: for in terms of the impetus of recognizing the ramifications of poor decisions right? This is really a sounding board. I mean what it is is to be the vet
David Avrin: important decisions that you have to make, because the ramifications of screwing that up can be profound on an organization, and the people in that organization. What a phenomenal opportunity! And I've seen this time and time again for someone to say, we've got this coming up. This is really big. Here's where I'm going.
David Avrin: Give me feedback. What am I not seeing right? Where are my blind spots and and some kind sometimes very affirming. But other times. There's a cautionary saying we'll take a take a step back. Here's your risk that I think you don't see, and then ultimately those decisions
they have to be better, and your research bears that out doesn't it.
Sam Reese: It does. And I mean when you look at it, I mean, that's the business we're in. I I would say that Ceos are in the business of making decision, the success and failure of our businesses. You can directly connected to the decisions that we make, and that that's how we think about this this peer advisory group and the coach that you work with the chairs, those biggest decisions, the biggest decisions you have
Sam Reese: should come to that group. Very rarely
Sam Reese: do I find those decisions completely reaffirmed by the way. Very, very rarely. There's always a little something you didn't see.
Sam Reese: even when I've brought my own issues to think I know i'm gonna do it. I got a wired, but i'll just bring it to the group to see, and then you're like, oh.
Sam Reese: hadn't thought about that. But that's what business we're in as leaders. We've got to make decisions that our company's success or fail based upon those.
David Avrin: Yeah. Well, the the blind spots, I think a really important part. I was in a group once, and they were passing financials. There was one of the members was doing his presentation. His hosts presentation learning a little bit more about his business, but he was relaying. Here's what's happening. Here's what our runway looks like, and he was pretty proud of it. He had some really big contracts coming, and they were passing financials, and some people are stronger in that than others. But one individual said, Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!
David Avrin: He's like! And this is a very you know, as you know, a very informal environment where people can be very vulnerable. He was like
David Avrin: dude. You're out of business in October. He's like what he said. I just signed the biggest contract, he says. Look at, he says you're being paid on a net net 90. You got this. He says you're out of cash mid October.
David Avrin: he said. That checks gonna come, but your doors are going to be closed, and of course it and that diverted the conversation for the next hour to help him work through all of that. This is save businesses. It's save families.
Sam Reese: When I was working in my earlier on in my career. There was a great company called the Ihs, with a legendary leader named Jerry Sted. I don't know if you ever ran across him, but he was incredible leader.
Sam Reese: and I I was calling on him. This is my days, and Miller Hyman and I. He invited me to his executive staff meeting, and he did something that I adopted from that day forward. And it's something we do. Advantage is every meeting started
Sam Reese: with the story about one of his customers, and what the value was that they were delivering to those customers.
Sam Reese: We do the same thing advantage. Every every meeting starts with a member story about something, with their business or their family. You know basically the story of somebody going through a very difficult challenge. Here's how they navigated. Here's how vistage helped them.
Sam Reese: and what it does is it's not only do you get to celebrate all these members, but you get to bring it back to the the Home Office. If you were the people that aren't as close to them so they can get a feel for why they're in this
Sam Reese: this helping us support this big purpose and mission and vision as well, and that it's just an incredible thing that we hear stories every week to just get us so excited.
David Avrin: Talk a little bit about about the learning and the revision of the model over the years. This has been around for 65 years. Right t you'd mentioned tech before that stood for the Executive Committee. Tec right, and of course tech has come to mean something very different in our vernacular. Hence the the name change, and that vista advantage.
David Avrin: But
David Avrin: there's no shortage of of Round Table groups. There's no shortage of competing organizations clearly, and and and all of them have their value. People have great experiences with the other ones as well, most of them unfacilitated, and that's a big part of it. But talk a little bit about
David Avrin: the learning over the years is you've revised the model you had mentioned and referenced processing issues for those who are undocumented, or have have not yet gone through all of that. Explain what an issue processing means, and and a structure behind it, without necessarily giving up trade secrets.
David Avrin: talk about the benefit of of a process
to keep things
Sam Reese: moving towards a a positive resolution and not going off the rails.
Sam Reese: Scale right the scale. Now, you have 45,000 members. So and now imagine electronic platform that goes with it. So you can not only get the insights of the the 12 people or 15 people in your room. You can reach out to somebody in any country around the world and see if they have some insights so, and i'll, i'll touch on that. But
Sam Reese: but central to how we create this space in these meetings and make sure that our members get value is a way we process an issue. I I use that as a generic term, but somebody has a big, a big deal they want to work with. We don't just start brainstorming people don't start selling their ideas. It's real discipline process like.
Sam Reese: What is it you're trying to accomplish? What have you done so far, right? So that's where you start, and then everybody gets to ask questions. No, no solutions. Ask questions after you go through a questioning process, then the person gets to restate what their issue is like. Now that they've been through it. They go, you know, and oftentimes it ends up. Being this, I started with
Sam Reese: a problem, right? The problem with the problem with this big one, and then by the end of it, i'm like, I think it's a different problem. Oftentimes it's a problem, maybe, that i'm causing. And then from there we we go through a process of people making some recommendations, and that's where it's flipping gold. You're like, wow, boom, boom, boom!
Sam Reese: But to your point i'm still the CEO of my organization. I'll make the decision. Keep giving me the feedback. Thanks. And then I I leave the meeting with a commitment to tell people what i'm going to do, and it might be I'm going to think about it today. Thanks, guys, or it might be Here's what i'm going to do. I'll let you know how it goes, but that's the magic of it
absolutely. I I found it actually made me smile at the beginning, because it is so
David Avrin: who we all are, was in learning about the issue processing processes. When somebody says, here's my challenge, and maybe it's a it's a personnel challenge. Maybe it's a distribution. Maybe it's a it's a financing or a funding option. Everybody in the room immediately has an idea.
David Avrin: Been there. I know exactly what it is, and they're so eager to give their advice. Right Part of it is just it's our nature right. Let's just move on with it. The answer. I've been there before, but they don't know. And so the whole discipline around. Just only you can ask questions, and you can't
David Avrin: give a solution disguised as a question, right? So I have a question. Have you tried doing? No, no, it's not a question. That's a solutions guys right? And you had mentioned this, and the light bulb mode that I see is when the person goes to so hearing all of those questions is that the still is that still the same issue and see the light bulb going.
David Avrin: You know what I think my issue is really blank right then. Maybe they thought, do I fire the salesperson. And maybe the real question was, Have we clarified our our our best revenue generating source for our priorities, for the organization, whatever that might be?
David Avrin: And then at the end, and let's talk about the accountability part as well, because this is something that I had initially thought would be a big barrier.
David Avrin: and Ultimately it's welcome that there's somebody holding them accountable, even if the accountability is. I know i'm gonna be asked at the next meeting. What did I do? So I better do something. Talk to us about accountability.
Sam Reese: It it it definitely is a a little bit of a a feeling. People like it, because it is a little feeling of your commitment to the group like, you know, you gave me your time, your best thinking, your best ideas.
Sam Reese: So I owe you what i'm gonna do right, and you want that as as well. When you give a great suggestion or a great idea that you think they might want to implement, but it it doesn't feel like, you know, accountability in the office like. Hey, what happened? Did you? Did you get that deal done? It's not that it's. Thanks for the great feedback guys. Wow! I think I got what I want.
Sam Reese: but also safe enough to say, thanks for the great feedback guys. I'm not comfortable with what I heard today, so I don't know if i'm going to take anything from this discussion right that you have that flexibility. But being able to know that you want to bring it back to the group, because that
Sam Reese: is what makes the group stronger, and it's. It's amazing. The confidence and momentum You get in the group when you're like, hey? I did it. Here's what happened. You know. Things are great. We're even did it now. I've got some other unintended consequences. I need your help again.
Sam Reese: That is what happens with the accountability side of it. Is you want it because, you know everybody is vested with you.
David Avrin: and I love that
David Avrin: talk about the trepidation that some might have on the front end. And clearly this is an organization with 45,000 members, but a lot more people have said No, thanks. I think it's not a fit sometimes a trepidation when the ones I remember hearing, and they don't you don't know what you know it right? Is this uncomfortable feeling that
David Avrin: I have a health care technology company? What is this person? What is this woman with with the chain of restaurants know about my business? What is somebody in logistics or professional services or manufacturing? There's no relevance to my business.
David Avrin: How how do? How do you address that? Because we certainly know members understand it. But how do we address it for prospects who might be listening, who might have an interest. And let's answer that question in their head.
Sam Reese: Yeah, as often. That's one of the concerns often that. Or you know i'm a 100 milliondollar business. What can I learn from a 10 million dollar business in the same group? Those are 2 of the trepidations that pop up all the time right? And I would say, we we talk about what are the key issues people are struggling with because they cut across all organizations. You know, talent, management culture, driving the top line managing the bottom line.
Sam Reese: But you have to to believe it, you, you know, in my 8 years here it may sound a little counterintuitive, having run big sales, organizations, and a sales training company is I I've been really clear that we're not ever going to force it. If someone says, No.
Sam Reese: I don't think that's really valuable. Great, you know you. You think you can't get any value from 15 other Ceos. Who are, you know? Pretty smart people. Them got it, you know. We'll keep us in mind. I never want to push that, and the reason is because you will fail. The first group you first meeting. You come to and expect people to jump in and solve your problems, and you don't want to help them.
Sam Reese: Nobody wants you in the group.
Sam Reese: So you gotta be ready yourself and believe that you can learn from these people and believe that you're going to be able to help them, even though you may not have no connection to their industry. But you gotta be
David Avrin: a great listener to get there right. You got her if you, if you don't want to listen, you, you know you're not gonna have a good experience with us, but it's also the individual over the organization. I mean, I had 2 guys in my group, and and it was always a mix. I say, guys, but it it was men and women. One of them had a 50 million dollar company.
David Avrin: but they had both run 50 to 100 millionThis is like their third time around. and so what you don't know, and and I love watching the recognition. The appreciation is people realize at the end of a meeting like
David Avrin: Oh, she is pretty darn smart. It's the individual over the organization isn't it
Sam Reese: always, and I always think when I was a member of first a member, One of the most incredible people in the group was a woman who actually ran a non-profit hospice.
Sam Reese: and she was. She's an incredible leader, but I remember the first 2 meetings just thinking, you know. How Will she help? Well, I mean this. This woman, you know, was a management. Guru was an incredible cultural driver.
Sam Reese: and when she spoke, you know, I listened, and it completely different businesses. But she was just an amazing and so. But you gotta believe that right. If you believe that
Sam Reese: any. If you walk into a meeting believing you're smarter than everyone, because maybe in your office you get to be the big guy or gal there. Will you walk in there? Nobody's thinking you're smarter than everyone here. It's not even a hierarchy that exists in these groups. The hierarchy, the only hierarchy, is the chair.
Sam Reese: The chair is leader of the group, and we're all here to to work together to solve each other's problems. And even as I say it, I get inspired by that's what makes it fun.
David Avrin: I like the mindset that I don't want to be the smartest person in the room. Right? I mean I. You know the better of us right. Absolutely Get a better room
David Avrin: once again talking to to Sam Reese, who is the CEO of vistage, boy. We could talk all day, but I may want to be respectful of the time, and of course.
David Avrin: for those who are who are listening or watching this this isn't a commercial. This is this is an an endorsement of the model of surrounding yourself with really smart people who will call your Bs.
David Avrin: who will infuse you with perspective and wisdom that you don't, have I? I love this sort of this mindset that says each of us has this cube around our head, this 18 inch cube, and everything that you know everything. You've experienced everything you loved and lost and learned is in that cube.
David Avrin: and everything you don't know is outside of that cube.
David Avrin: and this is an opportunity to bolster your wisdom a lot of other competing organizations. I endorse only because I've had a great connection with vistage for so many years, and and the other part I let's. Let's touch on this really quickly, because we haven't yet is that
David Avrin: not only are they, or is a group meeting monthly. But you're bringing in outside experts. Resource speakers. Talk about the benefit of that.
Sam Reese: It's sort of incredible, You know a 1,000 speakers. I know you've done great work for us. Thank you, David. A 1,000 speakers in the States, you know another 1,000 across across the rest of the world, and it's all designed to bring people in that are
Sam Reese: our experts in topics that business leaders needed to understand. Maybe it's a cultural expert. Maybe it's somebody on how to run your business more efficiently from a financial perspective. Maybe it's somebody around leadership, but
Sam Reese: it goes with our model of Remember, we're trying to always build more perspectives. So when when people make decisions, they have more perspectives to draw from.
Sam Reese: and what you find when you bring those experts in is it creates another great dialogue. The expert leaves Spencer a couple of hours. Now the team talks about that topic, and new issues emerge that you didn't even know you had so like where you were talking to the start, those blind spots
Sam Reese: start to pop up. One of the things I was going to add is where you get really good
Sam Reese: when you're hanging with, You know some great leaders. You get really good
Sam Reese: and asking questions. That's where I think everybody gets better when I, I people all Ceos will ask me like, what what will I look like in 5 years after being a message member, and i'll see not only will you be successful? You'll be more successful. You'll have a life that feels more balanced.
Sam Reese: You're going to be like a ninja on asking questions.
Sam Reese: and that is so much more fun as a leader than thinking. You gotta tell everybody what's going on but asking questions. Oh, and that's what you know People want. They want leaders that ask questions, respect their opinion, and and the things that they're trying to drive.
David Avrin: Yeah, and and the speakers that you bring in the outside expertise. Whether it's it's emotional intelligence, whether it's health, I mean, if people come in and talk about this, keep to. There was a a group that I had spoken for, and the month before they had all gone and done a heart scan.
David Avrin: One of the members had worked out a special rate, and every one of the members did a hard scan, so that they're checking on each other at the beginning of every meeting there's a check in how are you doing in your business? How are you doing in your personal life? And you feel like there's people who have your back, and that's very important in their part is that everybody's there is vetted. So not only are the members vetted
and curated.
David Avrin: but the speakers, and outside I mean, there's no shortage of people that would love to get in front of an organization of Ceos and sell their wares, and they're locked out.
Sam Reese: They're like that, we, I mean. I in a week they will have a 100 applications a week with people trying to be vistage speakers. Because, yeah, sounds great. I I can go speak to 15 Ceos of time and sell my wares. There's no selling. Our Ceos are all smart enough to know.
Sam Reese: Hey? She's really great presenter. She has some incredible information. I can call her up and have her do work for my business. They're all smart enough to figure that out. They don't need a sales pitch.
David Avrin: but I've been talking
David Avrin: between the groups between a collaborative CEO mastermind model
David Avrin: and
Sam Reese: a a perception that might be that this is a networking opportunity. I I I like to talk about, and I you know we have. There's great groups out there as well, but a lot of the groups are to meet people and hang out and exchange business cards and do deals together
Sam Reese: That doesn't happen at vestige. I I always describe it as vistage leaders. Sleeves are rolled up. You know they're coming in. Sleeves are all up. Everybody's ready to work now over time. People might do business together, but that is not at all what it's about. If your first meeting you're passing out your business card and telling people to call you
Sam Reese: that'll be your last meeting
Sam Reese: that doesn't work.
David Avrin: Everything's got to be safe, you know. So it's also so wonderfully collegial, because I've had the privilege as a speaker of seeing hundreds of vista chairs do what they do. It's so palpable to me. The groups
David Avrin: that, like each other.
Sam Reese: you can see the greeting they're so happy to see each other. They get down to work to be clear.
Sam Reese: You look back on the ups and downs, and we we know everything that happened to each other's, businesses to their families, to their highs and that
Sam Reese: vested. And when you miss a vestige meeting, I miss one this month from a travel conflict I mean it bums you out. It really bums you out because you don't get that connection. These are, you know, very special people.
David Avrin: Yeah, all right. So so we're quickly. I like to close that with a quick speed round, rapid questions. You have your tentacles in so many different businesses, industries.
David Avrin: part of of of the the hallmark of vestiges, that you have your your your your ear to the I'm gonna mix metaphors here. I'm gonna say you're the grindstone that doesn't work. But but you know what's happening in the business world. You do your your your confidence index. You've got your own IP as well
David Avrin: in terms of what you're seeing. Tell us what it what's the biggest, the best, probably the most profound transformation
that you're seeing. What are we going to see that you see behind the scenes that's coming down the pike.
Sam Reese: It. It is an amazing kind of viewpoint that we're able to have, because not only do we have all these groups remember they're all talking online every day and sharing information. And i'd say one of the biggest transformations, because people
Sam Reese: people are definitely confidence has gone up a little bit in last quarter from where it was. But it's still way down. because people are pretty nervous about the future environment. But one of the things you see consistently happening right now is
Sam Reese: is this concept of really muscle billing your team so that you got leaders at all levels so? And it may sound different than other organizations or other companies, but
Sam Reese: vistage members all over saying, how do I make sure that I've got leaders at every level to give me leverage
Sam Reese: rather than how do I just myself figure it all out because I know I can't, can't do it by myself, but that is a huge trend looking for ways to support. That, I think, is big and then huge. Every day people are talking about which it aligns.
Sam Reese: keeping their best and brightest people. It is all about talent, talent, talent, right now, knowing that in a tumultuous environment you gotta have your best people excited and happy, and believe in what you're doing.
Sam Reese: that Those are the hottest things people are talking about right now.
David Avrin: Nice couple of questions about you. What did you want to be when you were 18?
Sam Reese: Oh, I knew what I wanted to be. There was only one thing, and I was well on the path path. I want to be the fastest 5,000 meter runner in the world, and I was a state champ in Colorado a couple of times over. I was an all American at the University of Colorado, had a few brothers that were as well.
Sam Reese: and was on that path, and it at 22. That path went sideways with a little bit of injury that happens to a lot of runners, so
Sam Reese: I didn't know what I wanted to do after that right now. That was the only goal I had, so I I then. But you were focused on. Yeah, but it's still high achievement. I mean that that's a it's lofty aspiration. What's the best decision you think you've ever made
Sam Reese: best decision of a personal.
Sam Reese: personal or professional. Well, best personal. It's marrying my wife, my high School sweetheart 38 years. So that was Number One best decision in business. Best decision a vistage group ever helped me out with
Sam Reese: was hiring a new Cfo back in my days, and I I guess about 2,005
Sam Reese: hiring a new Cfo that transformed my business, and still is one of my very dear friends in life here. But he he was just in correct. In fact, his presentation every time would be. Let me tell you about our software business. This is a business. Sam told me not to go into it, and it's our fastest growing business, right? That was the kind of guy he was. They just an amazing person.
David Avrin: That's awesome. You know what I actually made me think for a second of in my time with vintage the best decision that came out of that I had an opportunity to speak in a country that's pretty dangerous.
David Avrin: and I gotten an invitation, and I kind of let it set it out to everybody. Also, said i'm debating this. The State Department website says, don't go there. It's very dangerous. And then the group started asking me questions. I want to ask, Why would you go? Is it? Is it, ego?
David Avrin: And I had to pause for a second. I said.
David Avrin: Yes, it is. I want to be able to brag that I spoke there another person asked, what would you?
David Avrin: What would it say to your children if you accepted this
David Avrin: dangerous thing? And there were questions that all just sort of made me think you know what's the worst case scenario? How would you deliver yourself if Blank and Blake? And at the very end
David Avrin: I literally, from my phone right there. I I declined that the presentation they gave me that perspective that was so important. Listen, we. We're way over time. I got more stuff I would love to talk. It's such a it's such a treatment of privilege, because I am I'm all in, and i'm a big fan of of the model and of the organization I've seen firsthand the transformation it makes especially for emerging leaders
David Avrin: who have an opportunity to surround themselves with people who are really good at this, and at the end of the day they're all just really good people, Sam Re: so people want to get in touch with you, or they want to learn more about vistage. How would they do that?
Sam Reese: Easy enough? You can go to our website Www. vistage.com. I'm mine is sam.reese@vistage.com. And even if you're just curious, there's all sorts of resources on our website, even if you don't want to be a member. There's all sorts of resources you can get as a business leader that can be helpful to you, and we're happy to share those
David Avrin: outstanding. Hey? Thank you so much. Stick around. Hang tight right there. We'll talk on the other side of this.
David Avrin: I just want to remind everybody that you can pick up a copy of my brand new book. You see all my books strategically located next to my head for those of you watching the video version of this podcast which is available on my website or on Youtube. My new book is called the Morning Huddle. Powerful Customer. Experience conversations to wake you up and shake you up and win more business. Be sure to click to like this podcast subscribe. Click the little bell. You'll get notified of new episodes when they come, you can learn more about my keynote speaking and my consulting at date.
David Avrin: David avaron.com that's it big thanks once again to Sam Reese. Thanks for being with us. I'm. David Avrin, be good